Shebrew in the City
Shebrew in the City is a podcast exploring all things Jewish. Combining interviews and informational episodes, join Nicole Kelly as she discusses her journey with motherhood, spirituality, and everything from Hanukkah to the Holocaust. Giving a voice to modern Jews and spreading love and joy, whether you're Jewish, Jew-ish, or not anything resembling Jewish at all, there's something here for everyone.
Shebrew in the City
"Ladies Night" - An Interview with Cool Mom Entrepreneur Jenna Liu
Hey all you cool moms out there! Come join Nicole Kelly and Jenna Liu founder of Sixx Cool Moms as they discuss modern motherhood and starting new businesses. Jenna revisits her Jewish heritage and the powerful moment she celebrated her Bat Mitzvah on a Birthright trip to Israel, offering a unique perspective on the traditional coming-of-age ceremony and its profound significance when experienced in adulthood.
Throughout our conversation, Jenna offers an intimate glimpse into her life's transition from political account executive to entrepreneurial mom. She paints a captivating picture of creating a sanctuary for mothers on Facebook, where support and authenticity reign supreme. These mom groups, brimming with camaraderie and local business connections, have flourished into a beacon for parents navigating the complexities of modern motherhood. Jenna's tale is a testament to the strength found in community and the unexpected paths that lead to fulfilling our passions while uplifting others.
And why stop at traditional modes of celebration when you can innovate? Jenna's knack for throwing unconventional parties, from Nicolas Cage-themed birthdays to Halloween adventures, is a breath of fresh air in the parenting space. Moreover, her candid discussions on boudoir photography offer a liberating narrative on self-love and confidence. If you're yearning for a dose of laughter mixed with heartfelt community stories, this episode with Jenna Liu is your gateway to a world where motherhood meets the entrepreneurial spirit head-on—without losing any sleep over it. Join us and the Cool Moms community for a rendezvous with authenticity, laughter, and unapologetic living.
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Today's episode of Shebrew in the City is brought to you by Top Dog Tours. Whether you're in Toronto, Philadelphia, Boston or New York City, we have something for everybody. Visit us at topdogtours. com to book your tour today. Hi, this is Shebrew in the City and I'm Nicole Kelly, and today we are talking with Jenna Liu, who is one of the founders of a really cool organization. I guess would it be a company or organization, would you call that? So how are you today, Jenna? I'm good.
Jenna Liu:How did you hear that in the background? Those are actually my guinea pigs. You guys, you're rude, I'm good. How are you?
Nicole Kelly:I'm doing pretty good, pretty good, so I always like to start off by asking my guests about their Jewish upbringing. How religious were you? What denomination were you raised in, if any? Did you have a Batmitzvah? What was kind of your relationship with Judaism growing up?
Jenna Liu:Sure. So my family attended Temple fairly regularly when I was a child. I believe it was a Reformed Temple. Both of my brothers wore Batmitzvah at the same temple, so during sort of my adolescence we were there pretty frequently because I had two brothers that are seven and 10 years older than me. So it was like back to back.
Jenna Liu:Batmitzvah preparation. But other than that we were fairly secular. So we celebrated all the holidays but Jewish culture was very much a part of our household but like prayer and the actual religious aspect, we were fairly secular.
Nicole Kelly:Did you have a Batmitzvah?
Jenna Liu:Not until I was 21. I did it when I went to birthright Israel. So when I was a kid my parents gave me the option. They felt that for their sons it was important for them to go to Hebrew school and be Bart Mitzvah. Bart Mitzvah, you know. But in the 80s and 90s the female side of that, I guess, wasn't as important. So they said you can either go to Hebrew school or go to dancing school. And I was seven or eight so I definitely picked dancing school. So I didn't get Batmitzvah. But when I did birthright, through my school's halal, I went to American university. I was given the opportunity to do a Batmitzvah and read a Torah portion while I was over there and it was a really lovely experience. So I have been Batmitzvah, but I was a grownup. I waited a long time to become a woman.
Nicole Kelly:So ton of talking about that. What made you decide to do birthright? Would you explain your experience with that? For those of you that don't know, birthright is a free trip that you can take to Israel. I think it was to be like 18 to 26. And it's a curated trip through Israel and you get to go with other people around your age and learn about Israel. What made you decide to do birthright? What was that experience like and why did you decide to have your Batmitzvah when you were over in Israel?
Jenna Liu:So I always felt bad that I never got a Batmitzvah, like it felt like a part of my heritage that I was lacking, since I had so many Jewish friends and everybody had a Bar Batmitzvah and I was one of the only ones who didn't. So I wanted to sort of be part of that touchstone right that every young Jewish person gets to experience and I didn't. So it was important for me that at some point I get to do that. So they just asked if anybody hadn't been Bar Batmitzvah and I said I hadn't.
Jenna Liu:And they, like the leaders of the birthright trip from the Halal asked if that was something we were interested in and I said yes, it's something I'm interested in. So it was a pretty easy process that way. I went on birthright. Mostly, again, I had a lot of Jewish friends that had also been on birthright, so the idea was in my head. So when I found out my school had a Halal, I went and I kind of researched it and they offered that trip too. So my sophomore year I applied and was able to go.
Nicole Kelly:What was that experience like? To walk me through exactly what you did on birthright, what cities you visited, what the vibe was, because I know that there's people who I never did birthright, because every time I looked into it I would book a show. So by the time, so I aged out and now I feel like I'd want to go with my family, so we have to wait until my daughter is old enough.
Jenna Liu:So you can actually, though there's trips for adults through momentum.
Jenna Liu:So, depending on what your city is, so you can, as an adult, go. The same free experience. I think it costs like a little bit, depending, because you have to pay the organization that's sort of hosting it, but it's still fairly inexpensive and you can sort of go with other Jewish women around your age and bond that way. Oh, that's interesting, but for my experience I'll do my best because it's been like almost 20 years. We got me 39 in January so we did, obviously, jerusalem, tel Aviv, we went through a lot, masada, we climbed, so we got to do all that. It was a 14 day trip. I found it to be an incredible experience, especially because I turned 21 there, so they had like a little party for me.
Nicole Kelly:Oh, that's so fun.
Jenna Liu:So it's a really transformative experience and it was really interesting because during that trip I got the very Zionistic view of Israel and that was really the only experience I had until I went back around. I was 30. And when I went back I went back with I was visiting Jordan, so I was in Amman, we crossed over through the Jordanian border, which was an entirely different experience, than the people I were with were all different versions of Christian and so I was the only Jew and so I got the Christian side of the Israeli history, so you know, all the Jesus stuff. That was also fast like absolutely fascinating, right, Because when I went they didn't do any of that, because it was more like Jewish culture.
Nicole Kelly:Yeah, of course.
Jenna Liu:But there's a value in sort of going just for the historical perspective of both sides, and so I got to experience a fully grounded sort of view of Israel, and when I went as a tourist and not somebody on birthright, I got to speak to a lot more of the locals and sort of hear their perspective on what it was like to live in Israel, and that a lot of them aren't Zionists. They don't love the government there, they're just like America like nobody.
Nicole Kelly:Yeah, no, that makes a lot of sense it could be better, right.
Jenna Liu:So that was a really interesting experience for me and I really fell in love with the Jewish state again on my second visit because I got to be so much more immersed in the actual culture of it, the birthright, which is very insulated from the rest of the country because it's very much. We're taking you to these places, we have guards with us, you're on a tour and this is what the tour is. So they both were. It was both very different but both very transformative trips.
Nicole Kelly:I like that. You got the two different perspectives of that. So my husband was supposed to go to Israel for a gig in March of 2020. Bummer, we both took a trip to Dublin to kind of break up the trip and he obviously ended up not going to Israel. But one of the tours he was looking at was a three-religions tour in Jerusalem where it looked at Islam, judaism and Christianity and the different, I guess, tourist spots you could say for that. So I think a lot of people don't realize that there are other religions that have holy sites and stories in Israel and that you're obviously not going to see. Islam's a big part, a big part of Jerusalem.
Jenna Liu:And I got to go to that area as well. Like there's a I forget what it's called and I'm sorry my memory is so bad, but in Jerusalem it's not like a downtown area, so I'm so wrong but there's like different sections that are Christianity, judaism and Islam, and they're different, like shopping districts, and you can go to the different districts and get a different experience based on, I guess, what you're looking for, what the tourism is doing at the time. So I got to do that as well and I found that really just a fascinating experience and they're all very close to each other.
Nicole Kelly:Where did you have your bat mitzvah when you were in Israel? Was it a temple? It was like a community center. Okay, yeah, what did you have to do? Did you read from the tour? Did you have an aliyah?
Jenna Liu:Yeah, I read from the tour. Don't ask me. It was gone like 10 minutes after I did it because it wasn't like I had practiced that tour portion so intensely. I only got it like a couple of weeks before. So I read it. They also helped me a little bit because my Hebrew is not so great. But yes, I read from the tour.
Nicole Kelly:Do you think that, being an adult but a mitzvah, the feeling, I think, was different. Do you think you got more out of the experience because you weren't 13 and you were now making this decision as an adult and it was a different process?
Jenna Liu:Yeah, it felt it didn't feel as all-encompassing as it would if I had been going to Hebrew school since I was eight years old through 13 and did all of that. So it was kind of easier. It was very much a ceremonial thing, but I enjoyed it and I didn't feel like I had missed out on everything that everybody else did from eight to 13 because I had a sweet 16. That was like the giveaway. My brothers have bar mitzvahs. I got a sweet 16. So it was literally like I got the same party that I would have. So I didn't feel like I was missing any element of it. I sort of got the whole package just broken up.
Nicole Kelly:So you have a young daughter, I do.
Jenna Liu:How has, how old is she? She just turned four, September 23rd.
Nicole Kelly:Oh, that's so cool. How is having a daughter change your relationship with Judaism, if at all?
Jenna Liu:So I had always known that I wanted to raise whatever child I had Jewish. It was like very important to me and I'm my mom and my dad are Jewish and my grandparents were Ashkenaz Jews, 150% To the point. I did ancestrycom and I was like my friend gave me this gift and I was like this seems I know where I'm from the 23 and me.
Jenna Liu:Yeah, but this was ancestry, specifically, and I was like I pretty much know where we're from, but sure, let's do it. And it said I was 97% European Jew and I said that tracks. And then I got an email six months later that said your results have been updated and I said, oh cool, what's new? And it said I was 100% European.
Nicole Kelly:She's like.
Jenna Liu:there's no doubt how new I wish I had very like like we are Eastern, Western European Jews, so I knew that I wanted to break right the 3% was kind of they had to confirm the 3% just to make sure I feel like you're very-. There's like no doubt you are a Jew.
Nicole Kelly:You know, that is why I have never bothered to do that, because I think it would have. I wouldn't even have to wait the couple of months, it would just immediately come back as 100%, because my family is literally like Fiddler on the roof, like I had a great grandfather who was a tailor from Russia and it would not. I think everyone had like a great grandfather who was a tailor from Russia.
Jenna Liu:What's your, what's your. So I'm Russian, polish and a Hungarian. Are you pretty much the same? So related.
Nicole Kelly:So there's a couple of different places. On my mom's side of the family we have actual paperwork from Ellis Island from my great grandmother that says Russia, but her father's paperwork, which was a few years earlier, says Poland and it's the same town. So it kind of was like that shifting border. And then when my husband and I were at Auschwitz five years ago we found my maiden name in the book of victims and it said Ukraine. So maybe my father's family's from the Ukraine, but of course at the time it was Russia. So it's all that like. It's now Russia, ukraine, poland area. I had a great grandmother who was apparently Hungarian one but it, you know, very similar to you.
Jenna Liu:I had that with the Wainian, and there too that was like that that's that shifting border again, so it becomes like a little bit. So I want to go to Auschwitz and visit. It's such a, it's such a call that I have, but at this stage I'm almost going to wait until my daughter's old enough to be able to go, because I really want her to take her, but I'm not taking her at four years old.
Nicole Kelly:No, absolutely, and I'm not going twice.
Jenna Liu:I feel like I don't need to go to Auschwitz more than like the one the one time. That seems like a brutal experience.
Nicole Kelly:I want to take my mother and my husband really like truck out. He's like so I'll go with you to Krakow, but I'm not going back to Auschwitz. I feel like that was a once in a lifetime thing for me. You should go. What we what?
Nicole Kelly:What we did is we stayed, we visited Krakow and we we got a really great independent guide and we had to wake up at like six AM because it's a bit of a drive and you want to get there early and we got an independent guide who drove us and she was really great. She talked about growing up in communist Poland because she was, you know, talking about like getting jeans as a teenager and it being a big deal and the jeans kept getting shorter as she she grew because she wanted to save them. And the way it works is the museum part, which is, in the main, part of Auschwitz, is a guided tour with headsets, with one of their museum educators, and then, if you want to visit Birkenau, you. That's when we utilized the independent guide and we walked around and she gave us a lot of anecdotal information. It was really informative and I think it's so important and I mean not a lot of people visit Poland in general and I am a huge advocate for visiting Poland. They think it's a beautiful country.
Nicole Kelly:Yes, it has a really interesting history. So I love that you're wanting to go and to take your daughter as well, Cause I think it's as you know, the generations of survivors are dying off. It's so important to educate. I'm a huge advocate for Holocaust education. I'm thinking of going back to school to major in that.
Jenna Liu:Doesn't it almost feel? Now? It's been so long that people are they're becoming desensitized to how horrific it was, because everything is horrific now.
Nicole Kelly:And so it's. And also, I think that the idea of people not realizing, you know, that six million Jews died, that it was such a detrimental thing to our population it's a huge number of people.
Nicole Kelly:It's all. We've never recovered, population wise, from the Holocaust at all. You know it is really important to go. So if you're listening and you're interested in going to Auschwitz, you can definitely DM me on Instagram and I would love to talk about my experience with you if you're curious about what that's like. We also visited Dachau on that trip, which was a very different concentration camp experience, because Auschwitz was almost immediately turned into a museum, where Dachau was turned into a refugee camp for quite a bit of time. So you know the layout and the buildings changed. So it was very, very different, and even the different types of tours we took were different. I think we're probably gonna do an episode on that trip to Europe in general, because we were there for three weeks. It was very World Wars. You know what I mean Wow. But Dachau was a very different experience than Auschwitz, important in a different way.
Jenna Liu:I have a weird question. Yeah, when you went, was the energy there just weird, did you like feel it?
Nicole Kelly:Okay, this is gonna sound very surprising, but Auschwitz one was very. There were a lot of artifacts and you know we're having someone kind of talking in our heads, so it was very, very heavy. But when we went to Birkenau, I think the thing that was the most surprising was how peaceful it was. Interesting, I'd like to think that the souls of the people you know I'm a big believer in energies were more at peace than I think that you'd think they would be. But my husband always talks about how we talk about people thinking they were going to take a shower and why would they think this, you know, but if you think back to these people in these terrible ghettos and they're dirty and they're starving, and then they get on a train ride, that's horrific and then they're in now in the middle of the woods and there's beautiful trees and someone's saying you're gonna take a shower. You know I could being there, we were like. You know. I can understand why people would have believed that.
Nicole Kelly:Also, the crematoriums are no longer there. They were blown up during the Soderkommando uprising, which is something super interesting if you want to look into. There's actually a book I bought there about the Soderkommando, which are the prisoners who ran the gas chambers and the crematorium. It's a very heavy book. It's very dry. It's all interviews it sets torture in its own right.
Jenna Liu:It's like a different kind of adventure.
Nicole Kelly:Yeah, but if anyone is interested in Holocaust history you should look up the Soderkommando at Auschwitz and the Uprising. But it was very peaceful. It was definitely not the energy I would have thought it was, which I felt was a little comforting to me, because I've definitely been to places where bad things have happened and you feel really like jarred and it's really uncomfortable and you can almost feel the sorrow. But where all these people died, I didn't really feel any of that. It was definitely a different feeling than in the other part of the camp.
Jenna Liu:Yeah, all right, interesting.
Nicole Kelly:There's my Holocaust discussion for the day. I feel like what was the original question you asked me.
Jenna Liu:Though we tangented it a little bit, did I answer it.
Nicole Kelly:Yeah, we were talking about your Bump. It's Fun. I ended up talking about Auschwitz, which is something that happens in my life on a regular basis. Like I said, I'm really a huge advocate for Holocaust education, so I feel like I talk about it a lot on Facebook and I post a lot of pictures about that kind of stuff. So I'm definitely oh my daughter, yes, your daughter, yes, your three daughters' boys.
Jenna Liu:So I had always wanted to raise I had always wanted to raise my kids Jewish and my husband is like a quarter Jewish. So his dad's mother was a European Jew and his dad was an immigrant from China, oh wow. So my husband's a quarter Chinese, a quarter Jewish and then half just like generic, like English white, Okay, but he was very game for raising our daughter Jewish and I told him it was important. He even wanted to convert but I said, like you don't really have to do that because, like I don't need you to be a better Jew than I, like you can if you want to, but I'm not gonna. It wasn't important to me for him to do that.
Jenna Liu:So we she's Jewish, she knows she's Jewish, I talked to her about it we do celebrate Christmas and like Easter we don't go to church, obviously, but I mean like she can have Santa, like I don't I'm not getting so emotionally attached to those kinds of things and we celebrate, you know Rosh Hashanah and you know Hanukkah and all of those things, but she's gonna go to Hebrew school and she's gonna have like the full experience that I didn't.
Nicole Kelly:I like that you've learned from your own experience and that's kind of shaped how you wanna raise your daughter. I feel like even me, who did have the very. I went to Hebrew school from like the age of two to like 16. So it was even past we're in most people most people.
Nicole Kelly:Yeah, a lot of Judaism. I think that's also kind of shaped how I wanna raise my daughter. For example, I didn't go to Jewish J school. I went to a secular private school. She's going to Jewish J school because one of the things I think we talk about a lot is that I studied Judaism for so long and I'm not fluent in Hebrew, so it's one of the things that we wanna make sure that she is. So I love that you've decided that there was something that you maybe would have wanted to do for yourself that you're doing for your daughter. So I wanna jump in and talk about your company. You are one of the founders of a social network for moms called Six School Moms. Can you tell me a little bit about what inspired you to start this company and exactly what Six School Moms does?
Jenna Liu:Sure, so Six School Moms is a national network of social groups for moms. I founded it in March of 2020, two weeks before the pandemic, with the Express Purpose.
Nicole Kelly:Great timing?
Jenna Liu:Yeah, it was a good timing. Actually, I'll say that it was the Express. Purpose of our organization was to do in-person events to bring moms together, right, because motherhoods are really isolating experience, if you know, if you're a mom.
Nicole Kelly:Yes.
Jenna Liu:So I, when I found out I was pregnant, I worked as a political account executive so I handled for a television station all the political like candidate and advocacy media that came through the station. I had no intention of leaving that job. It was a niche job. It was in DC. I was kind of in the perfect area for it and I really, really liked it. When I was about six months pregnant I realized that most of my close friends lived in Northern Virginia and I lived in Montgomery County, maryland, and if you know this area, I don't know why people like can't handle like the DC as the separator. It's like oh too far.
Nicole Kelly:So I I heard something that we were watching, an Instagram video that says if you have to make more than one transfer on the train in New York, it's a long distance relationship. So this is even within the same city. I totally get the different states, even though they're close 30 minutes is too far.
Jenna Liu:When you're single, that's not like a big deal. You pop over for brunch, whatever, but with a kid I thought I was like I really want to support system of moms that are closer to where I live. So I say that I do what any basic suburban woman does and I joined a bunch of moms Facebook groups and I went into full panic mode. I was like, oh no, so what happens? Like you have a kid and you become this weird mom B where all you do is talk about like organic baby food and then like judge other people for how they parent their kids. It wasn't a vibe that I liked. All I was like, oh no, this is not, this is not.
Nicole Kelly:Yeah, this is not what I want.
Jenna Liu:I very much knew. And again, I had my daughter. I was 34, about to be 35. So I, like, had a whole life. You know, I was very set in who I was and I wanted to keep my own interests and hobbies and my own personality, you know, intact. I didn't want to just become Poppy's mom, I wanted to be Jenna Lu and I have a daughter and her name is Poppy. But I am my own person, outside of being somebody's mother.
Nicole Kelly:I completely understand that. I feel like maybe a lot of mothers in our mothers generation. They didn't necessarily work. Their whole life was their children. They volunteered to root, to PTA, you know they were mom and then when their kids leave the house they now don't really have anything and I definitely know that. That new going into becoming a mother, that's not what I wanted. Yeah, though I feel like you automatically become so-and-so's mom to people. You can't inevitably but you. But I definitely understand the idea of wanting to be, you know, involved with the things that you were passionate about before you were a mother. Because you don't want, you can easily lose yourself in mom 150%.
Jenna Liu:So I started my own group with the express purpose of it being a non-judgmental space for moms to sort of get together and make real life friends. And it wasn't a business in any way, shape or form, it was just a mom's Facebook group. But I noticed that we started growing over time and after I had my daughter and I started to talk with like honesty and authenticity about the struggles of motherhood. We started to grow and people really liked it. And at some point people were asking about advertising. And I did it for free for a while because I had an advertising job and I didn't like conflict of interest and whatever and I really just didn't have any intention of doing anything with it. But so many people were asking that I started to charge a little bit because creating copy is time consuming and people paid. So I started to charge a little bit more and they still paid.
Jenna Liu:And I had this light bulb moment where I thought, well, one group is one thing, but if I had a whole network of these groups, that's national advertising and I think I could really make this a profitable concept. So I reached out to a couple of friends I had in different cities across the country and I said, hey, do you wanna start this group and I'll pay you like a portion of the advertising? And I launched my LLC in March or 2020. I had like six groups, including the one that I originally started, and then the pandemic hit and blew up faster than I thought that we were going to, because moms were home and they were freaking out and they had no outlet, and so they came to us in droves. So we went from five to 10 to 20. And we have, I think, like 38 active chapters currently, right now.
Nicole Kelly:Is that in different cities, or yeah, we're in 18 states so we're everyone's in a different geographic location.
Jenna Liu:So we have, like all of New Jersey, most of Maryland, except the Eastern Shore. We have some in California, some in Texas, florida. We just opened one in South Carolina, so we're definitely all over the country. Everyone who runs the group, I call them a market director, so they act as a local influencer in their community. And that's really where the like, the beauty of the advertising comes in, because we created an entirely new I consider it a new form of influencer marketing, because if you look at something like an Instagram or like a TikTok or LinkedIn, it's very much a little me, me, look at me, get up, great I am, look at what I'm doing.
Jenna Liu:But on Facebook it's more of a we in these group settings, let's look at what we're doing. Don't you want to be a part of what we're doing? Look at who we're going to. So it's led by somebody who acts as an influencer, but the goal of that influencer is to get the whole community involved, especially to support the local businesses, and so our mission is to elevate motherhood to the 21st century, because we're just not there yet. So we're really trying to give women back their voices and let them know that it's okay to want to do your own thing and go out and have fun outside of your kids and keep up your own hobby. So we're really designed for women who love their kids, because we all love our kids Of course.
Jenna Liu:What have their own interests and hobbies and activities outside of their children as well and have their own individuality with that. So we do that in a lot of different ways. We do monthly events and every group is a little bit different how they do those, but the goal is to get moms connected outside of the Facebook groups to them, bring those relationships back to these online communities so they can build from there and people really develop real friendships. Doing that, we also people who run my chapters. They actually license the name for me, so they're licensing the Six School Moms brand and we help them when we train them. But it's their own little business, right? They sell their advertising. They get to keep the majority of that advertising and we teach them the different tips and tricks for how to be an advertiser.
Jenna Liu:It's like a franchise, almost it's a franchise but it's not, it's just difference in the contracting. Like a franchise is the whole thing. A license is a little bit different. They're licensing the Six School Moms name, but we're not brick and mortar, so they're not starting a location.
Nicole Kelly:What kind of events would why expect to do if I signed up for a local chapter to be a part of Six Cool Moms?
Jenna Liu:Sure. So we do our very typical like mom's night out. You go to a restaurant and go to dinner. I would do an act throwing. I have a monthly yoga and wine. I do a monthly business networking event for moms. I'm doing an event called Spirits with Spirits, which is like craft cocktails and a group mediumship with some like private medium lessons. I've done tarot readings. I've done retreats that are like for women's empowerment. I've done a yoga retreat that I did with a partner, great Seneca Yoga. We did that in Mexico. What else? I do so much stuff. This weekend I have something called Self Love. Saturday I got five vendors together to offer discounted services from what they normally offer. So acupuncture, reiki, botox and fillers and then dry needling. People can come into our host office and try one of these providers at a discounted rate and then hopefully come back to see them later. I do two large scale vendor markets every year, which is just like all local crafters and local artisans coming together for winter and Mother's Day to sell their wares. We do a lot.
Nicole Kelly:It seems like there's something, regardless of what your interest is, which I think is really great we try.
Jenna Liu:What I get sometimes is just interesting is people like yoga and wine. People worry. They're like I don't drink. Can I still come? I don't drink, we have wine there, but nobody's like you got to hit this funnel.
Nicole Kelly:Make your pressure, we're adults.
Jenna Liu:We do try to do a couple of different things because I really like yoga and aerial yoga. I personally do a lot of those types of events to draw in audiences For my market and I plan most of the events. I like to do things that I like to do. I do try to appeal to everybody, but there are certain things that I'm never going to plan because it's just not my vibe. If I have to host it, I'm not going to.
Nicole Kelly:I love that you're utilizing local businesses as well, because I feel like the death of the mom and pop store small businesses is a real problem nowadays. Being a small business owner, I appreciate that you're utilizing people locally who maybe are moms themselves, maybe it's a family business. I think that that's so lovely that you're doing that for these people.
Jenna Liu:Advertising in these Facebook groups is so important for so many local businesses. Advertising recommended in these groups can make or break certain businesses, but nobody lets them advertise. They have maybe a monthly business post or you can maybe tag yourself in the comments, but admins don't even like that. It's really hard as a business to promote yourself in these groups because they think advertising is so dirty because people abuse it and they act like.
Nicole Kelly:Yeah, I've seen that in Facebook groups I'm involved with.
Jenna Liu:They've ruined the group and they've ruined the engagement of the group. When they do that, what we do is we incorporate it into the content itself so that when people see the advertising, they want to support those businesses, because those businesses are supporting six cool moms and we create enough content to compensate for the advertising. So people just don't feel like they're being sold to constantly. There's an art form to it. We also teach them how to write copy that doesn't feel so salesy that it turns people off. One of the only business friendly Facebook organizations that you can work with, and we really want businesses to succeed, so we go the extra mile.
Jenna Liu:We have this program that I launched last year called Six Cool Moms. Approved Businesses will pay a yearly membership fee. They get listed on our website. They get two posts a year that they write and we'll show them how to write it. The biggest thing is that for anybody who asks a recommendation for, let's say, you want a house cleaner I'll go through and say such and such as the Six Cool Moms Approved house cleaner and they offer our members 10% off. It's probably the biggest value of what that is, and you're having me somebody that they trust, say that this is a recommended business. It hits a little bit differently than just a stranger giving a recommendation.
Nicole Kelly:I love that you specifically bring up the house cleaner, because I'm in an Upper Westside Moms group and I feel like anytime anyone asks, they're inundated with people who are that, and what people really even will say in the post is looking for recommendations only and people completely ignore that. Oh yeah, they don't care. They don't care. You know you got to hustle, but I definitely like that you're recommended or approved vendors. I think it does bring a lot more validity to that.
Jenna Liu:They support us, we're going to support them.
Nicole Kelly:Why do you think that these Facebook groups for moms have kind of blown up? Do you think it's because of the pandemic and people were just kind of looking for a community? Do you think it's because a lot of people are utilizing social media? Why do you think they become so important to being a mom in the 21st century?
Jenna Liu:Yeah, it's really interesting, but that's the truth. Specifically the Facebook moms groups, like it's a whole thing. I'm definitely not the first person to monetize it I don't think anybody's monetized it quite the way I have but I imagine that it'll happen in the future. I think people are looking for community, that it takes a village and that's part of our tagline. It takes a village to raise a child. But modern moms are lacking their tribe and part of that is we're in a very secular world. People don't really talk to their neighbors anymore. It's depending on where you grew up. You have your friends. You're not looking for new friends. So if somebody moves in, it's very isolating. So these are really a great place to be a part of your community and find out what's going on and have relevant recommendations and a relevant place to go to ask specific questions for your geographic location and your specific parenting issue. So I think that's part of it.
Jenna Liu:For us specifically, too, it's not just a resource listicle. Like you would see, we provide a lot of content. So we're telling stories, we're sharing means, we're acting as the leader of the group to drive the engagement and drive the conversation. So it's more like a media company, because you're coming to look exactly what we're doing, to see what we're posting, to be sort of a part of that environment and, yeah, you can get your question answered. But that might not be necessarily what you're coming to us for. You might just be coming for entertainment and to see what events are going on and to make mom friends. So we're doing things a little bit differently in that respect, and I think people want to laugh and we make them laugh. Right, we're talking about sex in a way that other moms groups are never going to do. We have like an after dark group that was like my, our fastest growing group. I'm blown away by how dirty minded, so bad, if our members are.
Nicole Kelly:It's amazing we're going to touch on this in a second, but people want to laugh.
Jenna Liu:They want to see like a penis meme and they want to laugh at it and they don't want to feel like, just because I have a kid, that I'm not allowed to laugh at that kind of humor anymore. They want to have to be like a boring adult right, like we kind of are trying to turn that, that notion on its head and be like where I'm a person before I'm somebody's parent.
Nicole Kelly:I want to hear a little bit more about this after dark aspect because I think that is really a thing that when you become a mother, people I guess stereotypically you're supposed to act a certain way. Like you said, you can't laugh at certain jokes, you're not supposed to talk about certain things, you're supposed to. People want you to act like you didn't have to have sex to have a child.
Jenna Liu:When I see a pregnant person, I'm like nobody's going to acknowledge the fact that, like that person had sex to get that baby.
Nicole Kelly:I saw something about on the internet about a baby shower a really weird concept. They throw a party because you had sex and your mom's there yeah right, it is which, literally, unless you're using a surrogate or you use something like I have you literally had sex and they're throwing a party because you had sex and then your mom's celebrating that you had sex.
Jenna Liu:Mosul.
Nicole Kelly:You know, sometimes you know even before they're asking you. You know, are you having sex? Like you know, we don't think about how procreation is sexual and sexy and we just, you know, I know.
Jenna Liu:Are you sure? Like if people ask are you trying for a baby? It's like, literally, they're asking if you're having sex. Yeah, I'm practicing, like I don't know, it's not your business, but no, I don't care. But yes, that's we're trying to like sort of change that notion and a lot of people more so than you would even think have alternative lifestyles that they don't feel comfortable talking to their friends and family about. But we now provided this safe space where they can ask is anybody else into like the, the swinger or lifestyler, the throw, like whatever it is? And so you have all these alternative lifestyles and people coming through and asking questions and doing meetups and developing their own friendships and relationships with moms who have similar interests to them and not being judged for it, and there's something really powerful about that.
Nicole Kelly:I love the fact that it's not judgmental, because I feel like so much about being a mother. You are judged. I didn't breastfeed because I was taking medication that wouldn't have allowed me to and I was in a new moms group through the local JCC and everybody was breastfeeding, so I felt not like they were actively judging me, but I felt kind of other than and I, you know, and then even people on the street you know it's the Upper West Side will kind of stop you sometimes to say things like my daughter didn't want to stand next to me at the grocery store and someone was like you have your hands full, and I was like she's not doing anything wrong, like don't even you know judging even my child and how she's acting like a normal toddler. I feel like being a parent, it's so. You're so judged.
Jenna Liu:God forbid. This is how I knew like I had done a good job with my personal community.
Nicole Kelly:Is that I feel okay posting a picture of my kid in a car seat, like you can't do that very many places, oh I know Everybody's talking about where the clip is, which is important, and I definitely learned from people posting that where the clip is supposed to be, and they are not supposed to have a jacket, but I feel like I'm calm down.
Jenna Liu:Yeah, I know all the rules, but yeah, it's one of those things. Once I posted it, nobody said anything. I was like, okay, I did a good job, but I posted to other people's groups and I've been. People would be like boo the strap wherever. So people are very brave.
Jenna Liu:You're very brave for posting a picture of your kid in a car seat. Yeah, so it's. It's a even. Still, we deal with a lot, a lot of judgment, because people, the way I view it, everybody takes in every piece of information that they receive in the world and it gets filtered through their lens of personal experience and your experience is probably entirely different than my experience. So something may trigger you in a way that creates like an emotion or a reaction that doesn't trigger me in the same way and it can almost be like wow, like like jarring, like oh, I didn't mean to like offend anybody with what I'm saying, but once you sort of make that connection where it's like it's not about me or what I'm posting or what I'm saying, it's about their own personal experiences, it's easy to take. You don't take things as as personally because it's not personal.
Nicole Kelly:I take things very. I think I take everything personally, which is my problem.
Jenna Liu:So I'm, you know I would be dead my job is entirely on social media Like I would have been a puddle of tears and just like judgment if I let everything everybody said like impact me because I've got a lot. I mean, it's social media, it's all good. Banana, they can be bananas, yeah.
Jenna Liu:I could say something that they are so triggered by that then they go and post on their personal page talking about how you know I'm this, that and the other thing. It's just people can be bananas, so I just like let it wash over me. You know, if it doesn't impact my bank account, then I don't really need to pay it any attention. And that was one of the first things I learned about having a job almost entirely on social media is that you just can't let that stuff impact your day to day or it'll it'll eat you alive. That's good advice.
Nicole Kelly:But also people listening.
Jenna Liu:Like stop being, stop being a mess on the internet. Like don't take it so seriously.
Nicole Kelly:Stop fighting. I know, and we were all perfect parents before we were parents is something to remember. I feel like I said things that I'd never do. This and I'm like here here, watch, ms Rachel.
Jenna Liu:Literally. I knew, I knew well I didn't breastfeed either and I just didn't want to because of my family. Nobody in my family breastfed. It wasn't something I was interested in and I I set myself up because I had prepartum depression. So I set myself up, knowing that I might have postpartum depression, to make my mother her journey as easy as possible. So I hired like a night nanny and so I did a group similar to the JCC and everybody's breastfeeding and everybody's like not sleeping and they're like wearing their, their war wounds of like being a mother, I like I'm sleeping eight hours a night and like I don't know what I mean. So I just tried to set myself up a little bit differently At the end of the day, like it doesn't breastfeeding, not breastfeeding it doesn't really impact, like how your child bonds to you or any any of that, so I feel like people are.
Jenna Liu:Just there's a lot of pressure to do these things and I don't get that pressure because it's not coming from science or medicine. It's coming from a place of treating women like we're still 1950s, housewise, where we're supposed to listen to everything our doctors say and what society says, but then also have full time jobs and look 25 and get your stomach back immediately. It's like all of the garbage of the 50s now wrapped up in like modern feminism, because now you have to do literally everything. There is no space, there is no break, and if you don't do it perfectly, you get ripped apart on the internet for not like. You know what I mean. It's just it's so unfair and I'm like done with it. So I'm trying to really like again elevate motherhood at the 21st century, because we deserve like give us a frigging break.
Nicole Kelly:Right, Even within ourselves. Sometimes you know like my house has been a mess this week, but it's. We've been doing a lot of podcast stuff, We've been doing a lot of work stuff, you know, and I've been keeping it two and a half year old alive.
Nicole Kelly:So I think even we're hard on ourselves sometimes. I, you know, I was like I look really tired today and someone asked me how I was at drawbuff and I was like I'm tired, like it's okay to admit I'm tired and you know you don't have to be perfect all the time and roll in, roll in, kind of looking terrible on the occasion. So where does the name Six Cool Moms come from?
Jenna Liu:Sure. So the my company name is actually Cool Moms LLC. I wanted to trademark the name because I saw the value of being an online company. I saw the value in having a densely created IP and all that comes with. So when I hired a like an IP lawyer, essentially to get me my trademark, she's like well, you can't trademark Cool Moms because they're two generic words. And I said, yeah, that makes sense. I was like I was like okay, so I need to put like a unique modifier in front of it. And she said, yeah, this kind of these names, kind of nothing was like sticking for me. But there were six of us who came to the first meetups. So I said, what about Six Cool Moms? And she said you can't do that either because Six isn't generic word.
Nicole Kelly:And I was like okay, what if I throw?
Jenna Liu:an extra X on it and she says that'll work and I got my trademark in like four or five months. It was like an easy process. So, honestly, six Cool Moms there were six of us at the first meetup. I used to say because I was trying to be cutesy that the extra X was like a secret between the six of us. But the secret is I needed a trademark but I branded really heavily and it's like I like the name of my company like a lot. I think it's a cute brand. But that's the story behind it.
Nicole Kelly:I still really like that. That's a very fun story. So what advice would you give to new mothers who are choosing to continue to work, but they also still want to be very involved with the upbringing of their children.
Jenna Liu:It's tough, very loaded question.
Nicole Kelly:I know it is a loaded question.
Jenna Liu:So, in my heart of hearts, corporate America is not designed for motherhood or parenthood. As a general statement, it's not. And it used to be okay with dads right, they work nine to five and leave it up to the moms. But now it's almost like the same thing, but now the moms are the ones who have to figure out what to do with their nine to five jobs while taking care of their kids. So it's just, I left my corporate job to do six moms full time because I just it was too much work and it's a pandemic. And in my corporate job I literally my maternity leave ended in January of 2020.
Jenna Liu:I came back to the office for a couple of weeks and I asked them my hours were eight, 30 to five, 30. And I asked for nine to five hours because the eight, 30 to five, 30, I couldn't drop my kid off a daycare or pick her up, like I, like it was just too. And I asked for nine to five hours and I'm like I'll eat lunch at my desk and I was in political advertising sales. So it's not like I really needed to have my butt in the seat, but the the my manager at the time, who was like a you know 55 plus cis white male with a wife who was stayed at home said uh no, we're not going to give you those hours, but I don't think that's your problem. Now that you have a family, it's time to think about your career, your future and what that looks like.
Jenna Liu:Oh and that went right into my ear and hit this part of my brain where I said did this mofo just like say that to my face? And would he say that to a man? And in my head I was like I got to get out of it, I got to get out of here.
Nicole Kelly:I'm like I can't do this. That's awesome.
Jenna Liu:Then the pandemic happened and everyone got to work from home and did fine. So it was just like they have this control thing. So I would say, like, try to get get out of corporate America or find some place that's really flexible, like you really need remote work hours, you need a flexible schedule, you need to work for an employer who's going to understand that sometimes your kids are going to get sick and you're going to have to work from home and it shouldn't be a big deal and it shouldn't you shouldn't make it stressful for parents to try to figure that stuff out.
Nicole Kelly:Do you think that your life is easier now that you own your own company? No, girl, no.
Jenna Liu:I don't either. No, I can please. You know what I thought that it would be. And listen, I'm living like a dream, right? I get to create every day. It's totally mine. Right, I get to support other women in business. I get to do all these things that I absolutely love doing, but it's still. I still have to pay my bills. So I have to look at the numbers at the end of the month. I have to I stress out about advertising sales to see that we're hitting our quotas, because if we don't, I still have to pay payroll and I don't get to pay myself, right Like.
Jenna Liu:So there's all of those things where yeah, so I love it, Absolutely love it, but I'm working 100 hours a week. I haven't had a day off in three, three years. I'm working so hard. I'm making so much less money than I was making in corporate America, but I'm working to build something bigger, and I've been doing this three years, and so it takes some time, but I like the trajectory that we're going in and so I'm just trying to stay the course. But, yes, in some ways so much better, right, because I can end this podcast and like go dick off, dick off the rest of the day and like nobody's going to tell me not to write.
Jenna Liu:The only person that hurts is me, but there's so much more pressure on me for everything else and also, if you own a business, which you do, it's so much more expensive than you think it's going to be. I feel like so much of my profit goes to the government.
Nicole Kelly:There's, we are, are. What is it? Our disability, and it's the you want me to talk?
Jenna Liu:Yeah, what is the?
Nicole Kelly:which insurance is it?
Jenna Liu:It's the workman's comp.
Nicole Kelly:So workman's comp oh my God, so much money. It's every month. They're like you owe this much money. And then I thought you know, I think I've paid off for the year. And they're like oh no, it's started again and we just get these lovely little you know letters from the government saying please give us money for something you're probably never going to use. The first time we got a letter about that, I thought we were being audited by the IRS and I started crying and I told her see if you're there like no, this is about insurance. Yeah, it was so scary, but we always like to say that we traded a nine to five for a 24 seven. You know, that's what we've done. It becomes, it becomes your whole life, like it's all we talk about, it's constantly what you're thinking about. But at the same time you're right. Like I get to go and do stuff with my daughter and we don't have to have a nanny or childcare.
Jenna Liu:We, you know are able to get her.
Nicole Kelly:Yeah, it's, it's nice, but also it's all on you and, like you said, you're the last person you pay, so sometimes that doesn't happen, which you know is it comes with it comes with the territory. So, speaking about social media, anyone who takes a look at your Instagram can tell that you love Halloween. Is this your favorite holiday and what are some of the Halloween traditions that your family has?
Jenna Liu:Okay, yeah, it is my favorite holiday. This was a really fun year. I got to do like a bunch of photo shoots and it was really I'm very lucky that I surround myself with somebody creative people that like allow me to do sort of crazy stuff. So Poppy's only four. So we haven't really, and we kind of the first two years were COVID.
Nicole Kelly:Yeah, there was a lot of Halloween that she didn't really remember.
Jenna Liu:So we decorate every year, we do the trick or treating, I think, coming moving forward, I want to start doing like a little bit more traditional stuff with with Poppy, besides just the pumpkins, but we're still trying to figure that out, since she's so young.
Nicole Kelly:I love Halloween as well.
Nicole Kelly:We always do like a family costume and this year we trick or treat it in the neighborhood and there's apparently whole blocks will close off, like the associations will, will just close off the street and it becomes like every house which it's a lot of brownstones, will crazy decorate and there's, there were literally hundreds of children.
Nicole Kelly:It was the craziest thing I've ever seen. But my daughter was very excited and she'd go get something and then she'd come running back to me and she'd go mama treat like every single house. So I think she's starting to figure out what trick or treating is and we watch some you know Disney Junior Halloween stuff and she liked that. So I can't wait till, like you said, you know she gets older and starts to understand a little bit more, we can do fun stuff. So I know one year I love theme parties and I know one year you had a Nicholas Cage themed birthday party and I want the details on this because this is a very specific theme party and I know there's also a story relating to your daughter with this as well.
Jenna Liu:Oh yeah, so I Every year for my birthday I try to do a theme of some form. So I've done interesting ones in the past, not last year, for the year before I did like a birthday roast so I had like a comedian, like host, like a roast of me, which was really fun. I've done like adult sleepovers. I've done a pie, a pie fight birthday party, which is probably one of my favorites, where I got all my friends together to like pie each other in the face. Great, so much fun.
Jenna Liu:So the Nicholas Cage thing it just kind of like cage my head. I was like going to Nicholas Cage theme birthday party so we got a Nicholas Cage cake and a giant Nicholas Cage cut out. We had everybody come dressed as like Nicholas Cage characters. I Was, yeah, and I was pregnant at the time that we threw that party, but nobody knew because I was like maybe like five seconds pregnant, like it was a week before I even miss my period, so it was it's kind of a little bit, a little bit bananas, but so she was there, just like nobody knew that she was there. I love that party. It was really fun. The cake was amazing.
Nicole Kelly:It just had a giant Nicholas Cage face on it my husband saying he would Come as John Travolta in face-off to the Nicholas Cage theme party, solid, which is this all just you know, I saw that movie. I was in a dancer with the band when I was in high school and we used to go on this big trip and we went to San Diego and a bunch of us watched that movie in a hotel room.
Nicole Kelly:So we were talking about 90s movies a couple weeks ago and my husband was like he's like, what is this movie about? I was like they literally changed faces and he's like when did you watch this movie? This does not sound like a movie that you would want to watch like those like I was in high school and it was a band thing to be honest with you.
Jenna Liu:There's one line in that movie and John Travolta saying that it's like John Travolta, but in but he is mccage, right. He tells John Travolta's daughter, dressed like Halloween and ghouls, will try to get in your pants. And I'm like, uh, just like you're, just like. Still upsets me, to my, to my core gross.
Nicole Kelly:It does not sound like something I'd want to hear from John Travolta I don't remember that, but that's not gonna be kind of creepy. So you post a lot of really amazing Boudoir pictures on your Instagram. This is something I've always kind of secretly wanted to do. I want to Do you have any advice for somebody who's maybe a little bit shy or possibly uncomfortable, but his maybe kind of secretly wanted to do this for their partner or just for themselves?
Jenna Liu:sure. So I Think the first thing to realize is is that nobody's gonna have those pictures but you, so you don't have to share those pictures if you don't want to. But so many of these photographers. They specifically work with Moms and women who may be a little bit insecure, so they do such a great job of, like empowering you and making you feel beautiful, and it comes with hair and makeup and they pose you in the most flattering light. So it's I, just you have to do it. It's so fun, so fun. It's not as scary as you think. They definitely won't make you comfortable and they usually give like champagne and stuff, so you like so you loosen up a little bit.
Nicole Kelly:That's so fun. I want to do it. I just feel like I Look a little. The idea of like, even glamming up right now sounds exhausting. So this last portion, we call this the rip up of the actors studio, where we just asked some short form questions, so they don't need to be long answers. So what is your favorite Yiddish word? Verklempt Climbed, okay, what's your favorite Jewish? What's your favorite Jewish holiday? Russia. Shana, if you were to have a bat mitzvah today, what would the theme of the party be? Nicholas Cage, I Would want to attend, so I'm expecting an invite. If you do another bat mitzvah, what profession other than your own would you want to attempt?
Jenna Liu:Oh, I'd love to be a doctor that would also be my answer.
Nicole Kelly:I feel like I always love going to the doctor, which is weird. I like to talk medicine with people, same if heaven is real and God is there to welcome you. What would you like to hear them say?
Jenna Liu:Thanks for making me laugh.
Nicole Kelly:Is there anything else you want to talk about?
Jenna Liu:Yeah, if you're interested in joining one of our communities, you can visit six with two X's, sixx, cool moms, calm. Find our chapter directory and see what local chapter is in your area. We'd love to have you join us and also follow me, jenna Levine Lou, on Instagram and Facebook and I believe it's founder Jenna Levine Lou on tic-tac tic-tac. But I'm there begrudgingly because I don't like it that much. I'm too old for it. People just don't like my stuff.
Nicole Kelly:So thanks so much for joining us, jenna, and this sounds good to you. Please look into this. Cool moms, I think this is a really great company that is clearly very female focused, like that. You just heard subscribe and you can make sure that you don't miss any of our episodes. You can check out our patreon, where you'll have access to special episodes and offers, and I'm also on Instagram at she brew in the city if you want to follow along with my everyday life.
